Religion: helpful, charitable, relaxing, time consuming, war mongering, progress smothering, science strangling, morally inadequate, logically preposterous tyranny. No offense. In fact the first three, should religion truly be any of these, pale in comparison to the combined lunacy of the rest.

For thousands of years religion has existed unchallenged and unchecked by most people all over the world. The good that it does is minimal, the problems that it poses, infinite. Even now it exhibits a stranglehold on Australian government. Having almost completed the reformation of an anti-discrimination law that began in 2009, atheist Prime Minister Julia Gillard has announced that religious groups will maintain the right to discriminate against those who might harm “religious sensitivities”. In short, Gillard has given religious organisations the right to victimise homosexuals and women, the former having already been ill-treated in regards to her stance on gay-marriage. Is this the society we live in? Does a stone-age morality still hold sway in 2013?

Many of us know the problems the world faces regarding religious extremism, so I’m not going to go into too much detail on the matter. Who can ignore the martyrs of the Muslim world blowing themselves up, killing “infidels” in the process, in order to secure a place for themselves and their family in heaven? And yet, religion is still widely accepted as a positive force in the world. Even atheists and agnostics often maintain that religion should be allowed to exist if it keeps to itself.

And to an extent I could agree with this ideology. But on the other hand I know that there is no such thing as a world in which religion could keep to itself. I know there is no such thing as a world in which religion couldn’t be affecting me negatively. Not only does religion affect Federal decision making in many first world countries, it's propensity to create war amongst its people is undeniable, and this to me is a very concerning topic, especially in an age of nuclear power. I can already hear many of you saying "but that's not me, that's the muslim extremists!". And I’m sorry to say that in this particular instance, you’re wrong.

Religious moderation is considered by some to be a "new age" religion. People in this category understand the problems that their holy books have in describing the reality in which they live, and make up for that fact by choosing to take some of what it says as metaphors, or perhaps a simplification of facts to make things such as the creation of the universe user friendly. Either that or they have come to the realisation that their book lacks relevant contextual information, allowing them to have a moral check for out-dated practices. This is much better than extremism. Believing that the earth is between six and ten-thousand years old is beyond illogical given what we know today. But while this is the case, we should not for a second think that moderates are without problems of their own. 

The main problem they pose is their reaction to secular discussion regarding their views. Only the other day while calling trivia at work I brought up the fact that the "virginity" of Mary was not only spoken about once in the entirety of the bible, but that it is also a mistranslation from the Hebrew word almah, which literally means young woman, to the Greek word parthenos, or virgin. Of course the reactions I received were mixed to say the least. But mixed to the affect that I actually had to feign ignorance on the subject and change the topic rather quickly. The only reason I didn't attempt to reason with them is the unprofessional situation such a discussion (that would have inevitably become heated) would have landed me in as trivia master. 

As if I needed any more evidence for this, it is clear that religious moderates make criticising religion taboo. Their desire for "respect" pushes critical thinking out the door in such a way that it prevents people from saying the harsh but necessary things that need saying to, and about, the religious extremists. It also prevents intelligent discourse on the topic, permitting such idiocies as giving religion discriminatory rights as was mentioned before. This "respect" should not be given blindly, it should be earned. There is not a single field of discussion other than religion that is given respect this way. Where else would it be OK to say that you believe people can perform magic? Even if your beliefs happened to be based on a book, let's use Harry Potter as an example, they still wouldn't merit the consideration of an intelligent human being. Let's go a step further and say your beliefs were based on many books, Harry Potter, The Lord of the Rings, The Chronicles of Narnia, and so on and so forth, and that some people claimed these reflect reality. There would still not be one person (in their right mind) who would believe you when you claim that a boy named Harry Potter performed magic. How could you when you know that these books were written by people? And yet, it takes only a few books, written many hundreds of years after the fact, to convince us today, that magic can be, and was performed by men such as Jesus or Mohammad.

Religious people might here point out that Harry Potter, Lord of the Rings and the Chronicles of Narnia are written by men, while their doctrine was written by God. But this itself poses a problem, especially for those who consider themselves “moderately religious”. The predicament that most religious moderates face is that they are ignorant regarding much of the Bible.

If you truly believe the Bible is the irrefutable word of God, then how should you react to the following verse:

“18 If a man have a stubborn and rebellious son, which will not obey the voice of his father, or the voice of his mother, and that, when they have chastened him, will not hearken unto them:19 Then shall his father and his mother lay hold on him, and bring him out unto the elders of his city, and unto the gate of his place;20 And they shall say unto the elders of his city, This our son is stubborn and rebellious, he will not obey our voice; he is a glutton, and a drunkard.21 And all the men of his city shall stone him with stones, that he die: so shalt thou put evil away from among you; and all Israel shall hear, and fear.” (Deuteronomy 21:18)

Will you stone your children when they are disobedient? It is what your god demands of you. And if you don’t, what is your excuse for disobeying your Him? Many people will, given these circumstances, declare that the bible was written by men, men who are subject to the usual contextual difficulties.

Wait. Written by whom? I thought you just said the Bible was written by God.

The context in which the Bible was written should generate some scepticism regarding its validity. Aside from the fact that the books were written a few hundred years after the stories they describe, I believe there are things that could discredit it even further. Consider the education and intelligence of people in the Middle East at the time. Its people were potentially some of the least educated in the world except for a select few that had the capacity to write. In short, this Dark Age society would have been convinced of “magical” trickery as easily as we could today convince a child. If God wished to impart his divine word upon man why not reincarnate himself in, for example, China – a culture far superior in the fields of education and technology?

Not only can religious moderates not base their view on intellectual consistency, they are also - as Sam Harris puts it - theologically bankrupt. God was not a moderate. If you truly believe that the Bible, the Koran, or any other religious book to be the "word of God" then what right do you have to pick and choose what part of it you wish to believe? If you truly believe your book is the word of god, then by choosing not to believe that you should stone disobedient children to death you are disobeying your god, and in the same breath creating a god that suits you. Isn’t that a sin too?

This is a major problem that religious moderates face. In fact, the gods of these books are far from the gentle, loving gods that most people believe in: Would you worship a god who endorses slavery, even the selling of one's daughter as a slave (Exodus 21:7)? Would you truly condemn a man to death for working on a Sunday (Exodus 35:2)? And if you feel that these parts of the bible are subject to debate then why not the whole book? Do you, as a follower of god, have the right to change what your god has told you of himself? That is what you are changing if you believe the bible is the word of god. Do you truly believe that a god's commands and moral codes are subject to context? It seems to me that it would be foolish to say that an omniscient, omnipotent, omnipresent being's moral codes should be subject to such human failings.

What is subject to these failings then? Men. Men are subject to such failings. And if you are not convinced by this article that your holy book is the product of man, then I challenge you to read it. From start to finish. 

Some of what I've said in this article might seem offensive or even politically incorrect. But this is precisely my point. It seems this way because religious moderates preach tolerance and respect in such a way as to discourage the blunt and honest truth that demands to be considered by people all over the world. Tolerance of bad ideas is not only insulting to those who hold them, it is also dangerous. And in the kind of world we live in today, it is a danger that we could live without.

BOOKS TO READ:

Sam Harris - End of Faith
Richard Dawkins - The God Delusion
Christopher Hitchens - God is not Great



David Stoelhorst
4/22/2013 12:13:28 am

If I may make an analogy to demonstrate my view on today's world... I see religious points of authority/leaders as "farmers," people of society the "livestock" and the government as the money making machine for the purposes of this analogy, simply "the market" which recognises the potential for control of said "livestock" and utilises the control measures to ensure its own growth and profits.

It is amazing to think how many people must exist without questioning anything beyond their daily routines whilst being herded into a controlled zone ruled by the fear of non compliance!

My brain is literally clogging up with the amount of points I would like to raise in regards to this HIGHLY protected subject, but at the end of my questioning, frustration, disbelief and did I mention FRUSTRATION, I always end up with the happiness in myself knowing I am capable of using my brain to think and most importantly, QUESTION things that simply appear illogical.

I support this discussion and hope it inspires others out there to get involved and use that squishy mass in between the ears! You only get one shot at life, this is no rehearsal...

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Karen Cummings
9/9/2013 08:33:18 am

Having a mother who died of motor neurone disease and friends with parkinsons' disease other degenerative diseases- I support the use of stem cell research to help eradicate these diseases. And to discuss these issues from an ethical and philosophical position.

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Daniel Page
11/21/2013 09:52:58 am

Hi Mitch.

Thankyou for your willingness to express your ideas.

I assume that your comment that "it is clear that religious moderates make criticising religion taboo" was an overstatement intended for rhetorical effect. I certainly wouldn't make criticising religion taboo! I'm not an Anglican but I found it interesting that the former Archbishop of Sydney (Peter Jensen) was on the affirmative side in an IQ2 debate on whether "Freedom of Speech Must Include the Licence to Offend". I'm sure that you would agree that most "religious moderates" would not want to make "criticising religion taboo".

Without getting into the specifics of the anti-discrimination law, I was curious if you thought that people (including religious people and organisations they may form together) should be forced (by law) to do something they consider to be immoral. I was wondering if you thought that "freedom of conscience" should be a factor that should be considered when drafting legislation. I realise that many laws end up forcing morality on other people (e.g. I think you would agree that we should force our morality on murderers and rapists by making it illegal to murder and rape). But I think that we should be very reluctant to force other people to violate their consciences and force our morality on them. I don't really want to get into a discussion about the anti-discrimination law but I was wondering if you thought "freedom of conscience" is a factor that is worth considering.

I'm sure your aware of the standard Christian responses made about Deuteronomy 21:18, so I won't repeat them here (e.g. distinctions between the OT and NT).

Cheers,

Daniel.

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11/27/2013 08:48:34 pm

Hi Daniel,

Perhaps moderates don’t consciously make criticism taboo, but they do it anyway. They still demand that people respect their beliefs – beliefs that are arrived at by faith. People aren’t blameable for holding irrational beliefs, but they can’t expect a non-believer to respect what is to them so obviously unreasonable. If I were to say that someone was crazy for believing in the miracles of Jesus I would probably be labelled disrespectful and closed-minded. But if I were to say the same thing of someone who believed that the magician Derren Brown performed real magic, I would probably be considered somewhat of a voice of reason. Notice the double standard here, a double standard over which religion holds a monopoly.

And this double standard isn’t limited to belief in Jesus’ miracles. It is often taboo to criticise why someone believes in the first place. For most religious moderates their reasons for believing are not even evidential in nature. They are far more often related to emotional reasoning. One often hears for example: “religion does such good in the world”; “it makes me feel good to think that there is a God”; “I love getting together and feeling like a community”; “I would hate to live in a world where there was no God”, as if these were good reasons for their belief. Sam Harris points out this absurdity well when he asks readers to play a sort of thought experiment – substitute the concept that a ‘God’ exists (somewhere) in those sentences with the belief that ‘a diamond the size of a fridge’ exists in one’s backyard’. Here’s how they play out: “it makes me feel good to think that there is a diamond the size of a fridge in my backyard”; “I love when our family comes together on a Sunday to talk about the diamond the size of a fridge”; “I would hate to live in a world where there was no diamond the size of a fridge in my backyard”. These are the ramblings of a crazy person or an idiot. To point out such logical fallacies in ANY OTHER CONTEXT is fine, but to tell someone that they’re being completely and utterly unreasonable to hold a belief in God based on such reasons is “disrespectful”. And whether or not you hold your beliefs for such reasons, you can’t deny that such (obviously a posteriori) reasons hold sway for many.

This becomes a huge problem when it becomes “disrespectful” to criticise religions such as Islam for its obvious endorsement of violence toward infidels. Because of this shield masquerading as ‘respect’ many people still think that socio-economic problems are the reasons for Islamic terrorist attacks. And although I don’t have the time to go in-depth here (I may post a blog about this in the future, so stay tuned) the nineteen men who flew planes into the sides of buildings on September 11, not before killing many people on the planes themselves, were far from the depths of any socio-economic problems. Most were university level educated, some with PhDs, and many having achieved such a level of education in the west. The reasons for their deed were obvious.

But onto ‘freedom of conscience’. Freedom of conscience in this regard is synonymous with, as you pointed out, letting people kill if they want, letting people rape if they want, letting people racially discriminate if they want, letting people sexually discriminate if they want, and the list goes on. The only form of morality that I could accept when legislating, is a morality that is reasoned and well thought-out. A conscience that is derived from a book, and without justification, has no place in legislation. If a person or a group of people, be they religious or not, wish to maintain a freedom to act in a certain way – and this could be to discriminate against homosexuals or to stone disobedient children to death – they would have to present an argument with reason and evidence. No rights or freedoms legislation should be written on the back of “an authority has demanded that I act this way”, and for the record this authority need not be a Holy Book. It could for instance be a voice in a crazy person’s head – argument from authority in this, or any, case is flawed.

CONTINUED -

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11/27/2013 08:49:43 pm

- CONTINUED

Most religion-based-morality is after the fact anyway. That is to say that those who claim to be morally driven by a Holy Book already hold such morals, and they happen to accord with those in the Bible, more often and more specifically the New Testament. If, for example, it was discovered that a few of Jesus’ teachings had been left out of the Bible, and these teachings reiterated such Old Testament ideas such that one should kill any man who work on the Sabbath, or that one should stone their disobedient children, would you suddenly decide that this should become a part of your moral framework? I hope the answer is no! If so your moral framework is therefore derived from yourself. And in all honesty such a situation may easily have arisen considering that the books of the Bible were simply chosen by a group of men because they were the most widely accepted. Choosing ‘widely accepted’ books seems a questionable process by which to come by the irrefutable ‘Divine Word of God’.

So of course I believe in freedom of conscience. And legislation should attempt to make room for as many freedoms as possible. In my opinion one should be free in every way unless said freedoms interfere with the freedoms of others. I.e. one needs a better reason than “a book told me so” to discriminate John because he is gay – as he has the right to NOT be discriminated against on such a basis, a right that is reasonable and well-argued for.

I’m sorry for the essay Daniel, but I needed a little room to get the points across I think. Feel free to reply again. This is the perfect discussion forum.

Daniel Page
2/21/2014 09:07:57 am

Hi Mitch.

Thank you for your detailed reply!! I’m sorry I haven’t replied sooner.

I think you make some excellent points about the bogus reasons that many people give for why they believe in a particular religion. And I think you have every right to “tell someone that they’re being completely and utterly unreasonable to hold a belief in God based on such reasons”. Personally, I would avoid calling people crazy because although people might be unreasonable in the beliefs they hold, I don’t think they are mentally deranged (I don’t think you’re claiming that they are mentally deranged but some people could get the wrong impression if they took your comments literally). I think that we should try to respect people even though we don’t respect their ideas. In other words, we should explain why people’s ideas are absurd but we should avoid attacking their intelligence.

I am glad to hear that you “believe in freedom of conscience” and that you think that “legislation should attempt to make room for as many freedoms as possible”. I guess I would place a very high priority on freedom of conscience and don’t think there are sufficient reasons in this situation for requiring governments to force people to violate their conscience. I would be extremely reluctant to use the power of the state to coerce someone to do something that they believe to be morally wrong.

I just want to make clear that if I was a business owner, I would be happy to employ homosexuals. But do you think that the government should force churches to appoint practising homosexuals as pastors? And in general, should religious organisations be forced to hire people who disagree with their beliefs and standards of behaviour? It seems to me that religious organisations should be free to hire people who agree with the beliefs of the organisation. I’m sure you would agree that a Marxist organisation should not be forced to appoint an outspoken capitalist as their president. And I’m sure you would agree that the Australian Monarchist League should not be forced to hire Malcolm Turnbull as their chief spokesperson. If non-religious organisations have the right to hire people who agree with their opinions and standards of behaviour, then why can’t religious organisations have the same right?

I would see no contradiction between “a morality that is reasoned and well thought-out” and a morality that is based on a Holy Book (although that would depend on what the Holy Book said!). I guess the foundational disagreement that we have would be that I disagree with your statement that “argument from authority in this, or any, case is flawed”. I’m aware of the logical fallacy known as “argument from authority” but I think it is important to distinguish to between unjustified appeals to authority in philosophical arguments and the reasonable use of testimony in forming rational beliefs. For example, my belief in the seriousness of global warming is largely based on the testimony of climate scientists who I believe are generally truthful and competent in the statements they make on this topic. Thus, I believe that it is perfectly reasonable to believe many things on the basis of the testimony of people I believe to be truthful and who have expertise in the areas on which they speak. For example, I think that it was reasonable for me to believe that your name is Mitch on the basis of your testimony. This is not to say that beliefs gained on the basis of testimony are infallible. For example, my belief in your name being Mitch could be overturned if I met lots of people who claimed that your name was actually George and that you often used Mitch as an alias. I guess our disagreement would be about whether the bible is actually the testimony of God.

I sometimes find it difficult to relate to criticism of religious people because I seem to have had an unusually positive experience in interacting with religious people (in my case this would mostly be Christian people). For example, when Christian leaders are attacked in the media for being liars, control freaks and bullies, I sometimes find it hard to relate to these criticisms because the pastors at my church are consistently honest, humble and gentle. I realise that many other people have had extremely negative experiences and so it is important to take their criticisms seriously. And I realise that there are many religious people who believe all sorts of absurd ideas. I try to listen to Christian thinkers who are well informed and so maybe that’s why I sometimes find it hard to understand why Christians are attacked as ignorant and unintelligent. Maybe if I had more dealings with Christians on the fruit-loop end of the spectrum, I would have more sympathy with those types of criticism!! :-)

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2/25/2014 12:15:39 am

Thanks for the reply Daniel. I would like to first reinforce that I never implied that Christians or other religious people are unintelligent. And part of the problem for me is that because of such social indoctrination, intelligent people think that belief in a God is somehow justified.

I agree with you regarding the reasonable use of testimony in forming rational belief. But a necessary part of that should include a justifiable belief that those giving the testimony are truthful and knowledgeable on the topic - something you said yourself. The obvious question then is, why are you justified in your belief that the Bible is 1) knowledgeable, and 2) truthful?

1) Why do you think that those who wrote the Bible knew anything meaningful about the nature of the supernatural?

2) Why do you think there is any truth to the stories told in the Bible? I.e. why do you think the writers could not have exaggerated occurrences or made up stories altogether, and even if their intent was complete truth, why do you think they weren't second or third hand (or so on and so forth) utterances that weren't changed in their unwritten retellings?

These are two questions that I haven't yet heard a convincing answer to by any believer. They are also two points that NEED to be adequately answered before belief in the Christian God can be considered justifiable - not faith-based, which is synonymous with believing on no evidence.

If you do try to give answering those a crack in another reply be sure to not hold any double standards. Regarding the historical accuracy of the Bible I have heard apologists point out that if I believe in the historical accuracy of other old documentation such as those depicting Alexander the Great or Julius Cesar, then I should have no problem assuming the Bible has similar historical accuracy. But what those apologists have failed to note is that whenever there might be talk in other ancient documentation of magic, spirits, demons and Gods - such sections of the documentation are never taken seriously, and in fact ruin the text's integrity, even for the apologists themselves - and for yourself I presume. You don't believe in Zeus or Ra for the exact same reason I don't believe in Yaweh/Jehovah/the Judeo-Christian God. That there is no good reason to believe the documentations of said beings are reliable sources.

And to point out another flaw in that historical accuracy argument, no historian will ever say that they take ANY documentation to be the absolute truth even without the presence of magic. To justify the Bible as a reliable source of information is a battle that I'm afraid I can't see anyone winning.

And this brings me to my next point: Without an adequate answer to either (or both) of those two questions, discrimination based on the Bible is unjustifiable and should therefore not be a basis for legislation. I'll grant that within itself, a Church does have the right to discriminate against homosexuals - as they make their own rules - just as it wouldn't be outside of a gym's rights to not employ someone who doesn't believe in a healthy, exercise-filled lifestyle. But where the latter is discriminating to avoid hypocrisy, the former is discriminating for literally NO GOOD REASON given that they fail to adequately answer the two questions I posed and should, at the very least, be criticised and looked down upon by those outside.

So I suppose your challenge is, even if not in a reply post to me, but to yourself, to adequately answer, without any double-standards, the two questions that I posed. Once again, thanks for the reply. Always good to chat.

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2/26/2014 09:43:42 am

Sorry, one other thing:

"I would see no contradiction between “a morality that is reasoned and well thought-out” and a morality that is based on a Holy Book (although that would depend on what the Holy Book said!).

Your last statement "that would depend on what the Holy Book said" is exactly my point. That statement is demonstrative of the fact that you do not take your morals from a book in the first place, and that any Holy Book's moral code must go through your own set of moral standards before you agree to follow them. This makes the book irrelevant in moral discourse, for if the book's own morals must first be tested by your own moral standards why not just skip a step and leave the book out entirely?

The only important rules of the ten commandments: thou shalt not kill; thou shalt not steal and (a surprisingly nuanced rule for the time) thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbour; (the rest have nothing to do with morality) had been around long before the Christian God came into existence, and much of what Jesus said had been said before, especially in eastern philosophical circles.

Food for thought.

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